tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post3587376885042694103..comments2023-10-25T15:52:41.646+08:00Comments on The China Desk: On the Tenth Anniversary of Hong Kong's RetrocessionBevin Chuhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-29603962424798257502010-03-28T12:32:10.426+08:002010-03-28T12:32:10.426+08:00I never ever demonized China at all. I said that t...I never ever demonized China at all. I said that the China has a right to have its territorial integrity respected by the international community. That means Xinjiang, Tibet and Taiwan are part of China. What I do not like is the double-standards China expects other countries to accept. The ROC should drop its territorial claims in other countries. It is not conducive to good neighborly relations.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-79781052387950957822010-03-16T09:26:16.213+08:002010-03-16T09:26:16.213+08:00ah westerners love to point their (fat) fingers at...ah westerners love to point their (fat) fingers at china and talk about history. out of context, a fact here a fact there. what do they really know? our history older than all of theirs put together. who are you to tell us what you think belongs to where? it matters not, while you talk about facts, we make them. the world has much to learn from a re-awakened china. we are the oldest and the highest civilization. of course this is hard to accept for those who themselves became powerful not through wisedom, but through smuggeling opium and temporary imbalance of the industrial revolution.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-61988977671684239412010-02-05T08:37:01.386+08:002010-02-05T08:37:01.386+08:00When China demonizers sputter apoplectically about...When China demonizers sputter apoplectically about "Han Chauvinism," especially regarding China's territory, they truly do make asses out of themselves. <br /><br />If they bothered to study history, they would know that China's territory is immense not because of any alleged "Han Chauvinism," but because "Han China" so-called, was repeatedly conquered by northern invaders, including the Mongols and Manchus. <br /><br />The Mongols and Manchus deserve most of the credit for expanding "Han China's" territory. <br /><br />The Mongols and Manchus incorporated these areas into "Han China" when they overran it. When later they collapsed, their contributions to China's territory remained. <br /><br />The northern regions of Manchuria originally became part of China not because "Han Chauvinists" went north and conquered Manchuria, but because Manchus went south and conquered "Han China." <br /><br />Get your history straight before spouting your venom.Bevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-15488955961205779102010-02-05T07:48:09.932+08:002010-02-05T07:48:09.932+08:00Outer Manchuria is lost to China for good. And tha...Outer Manchuria is lost to China for good. And that is a good thing. Han chauvinism would be a very ugly phenomenon in eastern Russia and the Kremlin will rightly thwart any attempts by Han chauvinists to take Outer Manchuria "back".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-16556408630694715792009-03-19T22:18:00.000+08:002009-03-19T22:18:00.000+08:00Outer Manchuria is rightfully China's. In 1858, Qi...Outer Manchuria is rightfully China's. In 1858, Qing China was forced to cede the province to Russia. At that time, China was militarily weak and Russia threatened war if China did not comply. The absence of consideration and the fact that China was coerced into signing the "treaty" means that Russia has no legitimate claim on Outer Manchuria. <BR/><BR/>Outer Manchuria is clearly Chinese territory. The fact that the Qing Dynasty is no longer in power is of no consequence. The government may have changed forms (Qing Dynasty, then ROC, and then PRC) but Chinese territory remains unchanged. Chinese sovereign territory is unaffected by changes in government. It remains constant.<BR/><BR/>Russia has no business in Asia. Manchuria is for the Chinese/Manchus and NOT the Russians. The Manchus are now part of the Chinese national identity. Around 10 million live in China. Hans, Manchus and various other ethnic groups are all considered Chinese - just like how the Celts, Picts, and Saxons are all considered "British".<BR/><BR/>China has every right to demand Outer Manchuria back. It is simply a matter of China taking back what belongs to China.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-74084940644261148862008-03-15T12:35:00.000+08:002008-03-15T12:35:00.000+08:00Governments habitually betray the citizens they ar...Governments habitually betray the citizens they are supposed to protect. So what else is new? <BR/><BR/>A nation's land does not belong to its government. It belongs to its citizens. It is not the government's to give away. <BR/><BR/>The real solution to national territorial disputes is for both nations involved in the dispute to remember that the land does not belong to either government, but to individuals. <BR/><BR/>Until that consensus can be reached however, one must fall back on traditional definitions of territorial sovereignty. In which case, the record is clear to anyone who has eyes to see. <BR/><BR/>BevinBevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-70899612095049006642008-03-15T10:47:00.000+08:002008-03-15T10:47:00.000+08:00The PRC willingly and happily gave away Outer Manc...The PRC willingly and happily gave away Outer Manchuria to Russia. As recently as 2004, the Beijing government acknowledged Russia's sovereignty over Outer Manchuria. The PRC also accepted without hesitation the legitimacy of Mongolia's independence in 2004. Chiang Kai-shek was a fool not to recognize the PRC's new borders. He should have concentrated only on taking back land in China occupied by the Communists, not lands that clearly did not belong to China historically. The Chinese government should really let their citizens know about these border agreements. Reckless Chinese irredentism in Outer Manchuria and Mongolia could seriously hamper Sino-Russian relations.<BR/><BR/>http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/FJ20Ad01.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-69481274390968338912007-12-29T11:08:00.000+08:002007-12-29T11:08:00.000+08:00I invite all readers to research the history of Ch...I invite all readers to research the history of China, specifically the Yuan and Qing dynasties. The facts will speak for themselves. <BR/><BR/>BevinBevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-24545070810588567332007-12-24T09:41:00.000+08:002007-12-24T09:41:00.000+08:00As I said before, "It's always good to let China d...As I said before, <BR/><BR/>"It's always good to let China demonizers put their historically ignorant assumptions in writing. That's why I approve comments such as these." <BR/><BR/>Nothing has changed. <BR/><BR/>BevinBevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-74006986981429738912007-12-24T06:07:00.000+08:002007-12-24T06:07:00.000+08:00Historically ignorant? Puleeze. You're the one who...Historically ignorant? Puleeze. You're the one who needs to hit the history books and deal with the harsh (to you) reality of Outer Mongolia's and Outer Manchuria's independence. They were NEVER ruled by China. The Mongols and the Manchus did most of the ruling.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-69143615334725860132007-08-09T01:14:00.000+08:002007-08-09T01:14:00.000+08:00It's always good to let China demonizers put their...It's always good to let China demonizers put their historically ignorant assumptions in writing. That's why I approve comments such as these. <BR/><BR/>BevinBevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-58017821848600372782007-08-08T23:17:00.000+08:002007-08-08T23:17:00.000+08:00Since when were Outer Mongolia and Outer Manchuria...Since when were Outer Mongolia and Outer Manchuria ever considered Chinese? They were part of the Manchu Empire yes. But they were never historically part of China. I find it extremely insulting when Mongolian dignitaries visit Taiwan and discover that ROC maps include their country! It is a blessing that Russia assisted Mongolia in its efforts to liberate itself from Han chauvinism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-72921223698839294652007-07-30T15:36:00.000+08:002007-07-30T15:36:00.000+08:00" Outer Mongolia, outer Manchuria has been an inte..." Outer Mongolia, outer Manchuria has been an integral part of China<BR/>for centuries through their rule of China. Boundary of any Nation<BR/>changed as the result of close integration though changes of rulers from different parts of a nation. The shape of China kept changing in the past as the result of close interaction through merges of neighboring regions. That is no difference in any other countries such as Russia, India and Europe. There is one major difference, every race in China are being treated equally without racism we see in the west<BR/>where the indigenous races in N America , Australia were pushed out to the wild and discriminated in their own land.<BR/><BR/>Since Hong kong was returned to China, against the gloom and doom<BR/>prediction of HK future, she has make ever better progress not only<BR/>economically but also re-integrate well with her motherland. Few<BR/>Westerners wish to see HK do well under China and we Chinese has the<BR/>last laugh.<BR/><BR/>There has constant China bashing from biased China haters who simply<BR/>do not want China to grow and do not wish her well. That has been<BR/>going on for centuries. Despite that China with the new generation of Chinese will continue to make progress despite the China bashing. When things get tough China will get tougher and that in our blood but we should not waste time on those China bashers as time is too valuable that we should use it for the betterment of China"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-33548188408303934872007-07-23T10:50:00.000+08:002007-07-23T10:50:00.000+08:00Rebuttals to these "rebuttals" are too easy. Like ...Rebuttals to these "rebuttals" are too easy. Like shooting fish in a barrel. Anyone want to have a go before me?Bevin Chuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03212261042382022326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-38147779287600752652007-07-23T10:44:00.000+08:002007-07-23T10:44:00.000+08:00I find it hilarious and laughable that ROC support...I find it hilarious and laughable that ROC supporters can continue to lament Western imperialism, but continue to justify territorial "claims" to Outer Mongolia and Outer Manchuria. Those lands were NEVER Chinese to begin with. Chinese imperialism is just as unacceptable as Western imperialism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25209260.post-90448540733795486782007-07-23T10:41:00.000+08:002007-07-23T10:41:00.000+08:00Yet, somehow the ROC's "claims" to Outer Mongolia ...Yet, somehow the ROC's "claims" to Outer Mongolia are considered "legit". Please.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com